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Anthony
R.
wrote:
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Dear Mike,
I hope you are well.
I have had somewhat of a hiatus with a busy year, but I am thoroughly going through
the Catechism, and have also being devouring some other Catholic literature that
I have. I have to say honestly, that I am very interested in joining the Catholic
Church, for several reasons, which I will discuss in a moment. As I may have mentioned
previously, I have a Pentecostal upbringing, although I have been of Anglican affiliation
more recently.
I have grown dissatisfied with the Anglican Church, although it has many good people
within it, because I do not think it entirely knows what it is.
First, I dislike
that the church itself arose out of political circumstances, rather than religious
ones (and I believe that the Church should have allegiance to God and not to a monarch).
Second, there is a tendency for Christianity itself to become almost formal,
or a vehicle of social acceptance drifting into doubt and relativism, rather than
a deep inner life in relation to Christ in the Church.
On the other hand, the Catholic
Church has a very strong sense of identity.
I was drawn to the Anglo-Catholic side
of Anglicanism, hence my initial interest in Catholicism, but it is somewhat a question
of why accept an imitation when the real thing is available.
The Pentecostal church itself was somewhat more vague than the Anglican Church in
issues of Faith, and although I am all for personal interpretations within the bounds
of the Creeds, nevertheless there was not much Tradition within that church, and
very little depth.
As for my increasing interest with Catholicism:
- It is the first Church, and of course the
carrier of the Tradition and the preserver
of the Bible Including the Deuterocanonical
works, which I personally accept as canonical.
- I am drawn to the sacramental and liturgical
side, and in Transubstantiation rather than
a symbolic presence of Christ in Communion.
- The clear sanctity of many Catholics throughout
history such as:
- St. Francis
- St. John of the
Cross, and
- St. Thomas A' Kempis.
I can only
feel that this is through their grounding within
the Catholic Church.
- An increased suspicion that the true doctrines
of Christianity are within the Catholic Church.
No doubt there are more reasons as well. I plan to finish reading the Catechism first
and then do some deep thinking because if
I do take this leap, I wish for it to be for life
— as a serious commitment. I am only too aware
of my history of having been in different sects
of Christianity and wish to settle down once and for all.
I have several questions.
First, I am married and have children, however,
my wife is not a Christian. I am fully aware
of Paul's provision for those married to those
who don't believe, and If I did become Catholic
I would be more than happy to baptize my children.
As it stands though, I do not wish to make them
Catholics but would like them to decide on their own, with their own
free will and choice, when they are old enough.
I am more than willing to teach, instruct, etc.,
but always with a view of allowing them to decide the best faith for them.
- Would
this put me in ill standing with the Church?
I have had negative experiences of indoctrination
in Pentecostal Christianity and am not willing
to subject my children to this. This is a very
important issue for me as I do not want to be
a fake Catholic. I wish to be genuine in
my relation towards God and the Church but the
raising of my children is a deep, important matter of
conscience for me.
Second, I am somewhat confused by the changeover
of the Mass from the Tridentine Mass to the Vatican
II type Mass. The Tridentine Mass, from what
I have seen and read in an old Missal,
was beautiful and full of significance. I appreciate
the use of vernacular but it seems that the message
has somewhat changed as well.
- What are your thoughts
on this?
My third question has to do with the sacrament of Penance. Having been
a Protestant all my life, I am extremely unfamiliar
with the idea of a priest being a mediator
between myself and God. Such information
is intensely personal.
- No doubt this would be
a transitional thing and I would be willing
to do it but am interested in hearing your thoughts on this issue as well.
Sincerely,
Anthony R.
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{
Would the Church mind if, in raising my children, I let them decide which faith to believe? }
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Mike replied:
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Hi Anthony,
It's great to hear from you.
You said:
First, I am married and have children, however,
my wife is not a Christian. I am fully aware
of Paul's provision for those married to those
who don't believe, and If I did become Catholic
I would be more than happy to baptize my children.
As it stands though, I do not wish to make them
Catholics but would like them to decide on their own, with their own
free will and choice, when they are old enough.
I am more than willing to teach, instruct, etc.,
but always with a view of allowing them to decide the best faith for them.
- Would
this put me in ill standing with the Church?
I have had negative experiences of indoctrination
in Pentecostal Christianity and am not willing
to subject my children to this. This is a very
important issue for me as I do not want to be
a fake Catholic. I wish to be genuine in
my relation towards God and the Church but the
raising of my children is a deep, important matter of
conscience for me.
It would
probably help us if you could clear up one statement.
You said:
If I did become Catholic
I would be more than happy to baptize my children.
As it stands though, I do not wish to make them
Catholics, but for them to decide of their own
free will and choice when they are old enough.
- How old are your children?
Whether you were able to use the Pauline Privilege or not is irrelevant to whether your children could be baptized. The Church has to have a good hope that the Catholic party to the marriage will raise their children in the Catholic faith to the best they can. The non-Christian party makes no promises but is a witness to the Catholic party.
You said:
Second, I am somewhat confused by the changeover
of the Mass from the Tridentine Mass to the Vatican
II type Mass. The Tridentine Mass, from what
I have seen and read in an old Missal,
was beautiful and full of significance. I appreciate
the use of vernacular but it seems that the message
has somewhat changed as well.
- What are your thoughts
on this?
If you read my Mass and Adoration page off the home page, I think you'll
get a good history.
There are three subsections under the Holy Mass category.
To this date and my surprise,
I have received no complaint e-mails from it:
These set of postings will give you an idea of my thoughts on this issue:
You said:
My third question has to do with the sacrament of Penance. Having been
a Protestant all my life,
I am extremely unfamiliar
with the idea of a priest being a mediator
between myself and God.
Such information
is intensely personal.
- No doubt this would be
a transitional thing and I would be willing
to do it but am interested in hearing your thoughts on this issue as well.
This is a common question; it's even in our searchable knowledge base:
https://www.AskACatholic.com/SiteSearch
There are a lot of quick answers there, so give it a try.
I searched the knowledge base for you and found these web postings that should help:
If these questions and answers don't answer your question, just return
to the site and ask us some more questions at the Ask
us today! link.
I highly recommend
it.
Take care,
Mike
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Eric replied:
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Hi Anthony,
You said:
The clear sanctity of many Catholics throughout
history such as:
- St. Francis
- St. John of the
Cross, and
- St. Thomas A' Kempis.
I can only
feel that this is through their grounding within
the Catholic Church.
Actually, Thomas A' Kempis is not a saint for technical reasons (he was
inadvertently buried alive, and they thought it unwise to canonize someone
when they didn't know the circumstances of his death), though he was very
holy.
You said:
First, I am married and have children, however,
my wife is not a Christian. I am fully aware
of Paul's provision for those married to those
who don't believe, and If I did become Catholic
I would be more than happy to baptize my children.
As it stands though, I do not wish to make them
Catholics but would like them to decide on their own, with their own
free will and choice, when they are old enough.
I am more than willing to teach, instruct, etc.,
but always with a view of allowing them to decide the best faith for them.
- Would
this put me in ill standing with the Church?
I have had negative experiences of indoctrination
in Pentecostal Christianity and am not willing
to subject my children to this. This is a very
important issue for me as I do not want to be
a fake Catholic. I wish to be genuine in
my relation towards God and the Church but the
raising of my children is a deep, important matter of
conscience for me.
If you're asking whether a priest will bar your admission to the Church
on this point, almost certainly not. Your proposal certainly goes against
the practice of the Church, depending on the ages of your children. The
Church has always urged early baptism of children to ensure their salvation.
Baptism is necessary for salvation in the normative case (John 3:5) but given
your circumstances
I don't think anyone would call you on it, especially
if your wife had objections.
You said:
My third question has to do with the sacrament of Penance. Having been
a Protestant all my life,
I am extremely unfamiliar
with the idea of a priest being a mediator
between myself and God.
Such information
is intensely personal.
- No doubt this would be
a transitional thing and I would be willing
to do it but am interested in hearing your thoughts on this issue as well.
Sin is an offense, not merely against God, but against the community.
In Scripture, we see in
the Old Testament the whole of Israel being punished
for the sins of one person. So, too, in the New Testament there is a communion
such that if one suffers, all suffer, and if one part is honored, all rejoice.
(1 Corinthians 12:26) This goes for sin as well. Because sin is always communal
in addition to being personal, especially when it is grave, reconciliation
must also be communal. At the same time, it is important to ensure the penitent
is appropriately humble and isn't rationalizing their sin. It is also important that they are assured of God's forgiveness.
Just keep in mind, that James 5 instructs us to confess our sins to one
another. The sacrament of penance is just a specific case of this.
Also, if it makes a difference, Confession is only mandatory when we are
conscious of mortal sin. Not every sin needs to be confessed.
Hope this helps!
Eric Ewanco
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Anthony replied:
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Hi Mike,
My children are all under the age of four. My wife, whilst respecting my
Christianity, is agnostic.
My personal feelings on faith is that it is stronger if it is a full decision
made by a person, with all of the facts present, and from my own experience
being raised a Christian can actually hinder the process. I would enjoy
taking them to Church as well, but I would respect their wishes in deciding which faith is best for them.
I will read your articles on the Mass and Penance shortly and discuss
them with you afterwards.
On the Church Fathers, I have read:
- some of Origen
- some of St. Clement
of Alexandria
- the Confessions of St. Augustine, and
- the works of Dionysius the Areopagite
but to date I have not explored their thought, or the rest
of the Fathers as much as I would like.
Sincerely,
Anthony
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Mike replied:
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Hi Anthony,
When I first read your e-mail to me, these two statements stood out in
my mind:
I have had negative experiences of indoctrination
in Pentecostal Christianity and am not willing
to subject my children to this. This is a very
important issue for me as I do not want to be
a fake Catholic. I wish to be genuine in
my relation towards God and the Church but the
raising of my children is a deep, important matter of
conscience for me.
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| As it stands though, I do not wish to make them
Catholics but would like them to decide on their own, with their own
free will and choice, when they are old enough.
I am more than willing to teach, instruct, etc.,
but always with a view of allowing them to decide the best faith for them. |
I don't want any Church indoctrinating your children in something you
don't believe in either!
If you evaluate our Church and don't truly believe in it, I wouldn't want
you to join.
In my mind, when I hear the word, indoctrinate I think of
someone telling another person something, they don't want to willfully believe. That
is not what the Holy Father or the Church would wish. He and the Church
cherish each person's free will to discern and decide for themselves.
The nature of any father, or mother, is to want what's best for their
children.
If parent's truly believe in their faith, they will want to pass that
faith on to their children for their physical and spiritual well-being.
Your children are at the age where they are depending on the Christian
reasoning and intellect of you and your wife; something they currently
don't have.
I have a similar situation in my family. I am single, but my brother has
four children — ages 5-16.
Mark and Pam have a set of beliefs they both believe in. One spouse may
be stronger in the faith then the other, but there are still mutual beliefs
they agree on. If a parent wants what is good for their children, they
will form them in values you and your wife believe in, not because the two of you are indoctrinators, but because you both want what is best for them.
This is not indoctrination because their Christian reasoning and intellect
have yet to be formed. As my brother Mark states,
"If you are under
my roof, you follow my rules ... including when we go to Church and when we say the
family prayers."
Now to your point: At some point in the future they will be of age where
they can:
- drive a car
- keep a job
- make some money
and be independent on their own. At that point, you are correct, the decision
is theirs.
Then, unlike now, they hopefully will have a formed Christian
conscience, know right from wrong, believe in the Risen Lord Jesus Christ, and have a good knowledge of the history of the Catholic Church.
- Could they decide to go some place else?
Sure, but you and your wife can rest easily knowing that you are both
giving your children, what you believe is best for their spiritual welling.
- Can they throw it away? <Yes.>
- Is that your problem?
Not if you have brought
them up to believe what you, as a father, believe is best for their eternal good.
- Make sense?
Of all things that would be spiritually good for them, like
Eric implied, Number One would be:
- Baptism by a Catholic priest!
Our Lord
Himself stresses its need for salvation in the Scriptures in John 3:5.
Just sharing some thoughts. Try some prayer and quiet time to think things over.
Take care and if I or the group can be of any help, just come back!
Mike
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