Reigh Castlemen
wrote:
|
|
Hi, guys —
- Was Lucifer really as bad as he's made out to be?
- Did his punishment fit his crimes?
- Was God too harsh and irrational by casting him out of Heaven instead of talking to him and trying to understand his side of the story?
- Would it have been more effective and loving of God to try to understand what was causing his son to act in such a way, to lecture him, and help him through it instead of throwing him away like he's trash?
- Did casting Lucifer out of Heaven make him more hateful, resentful, and maybe even hurt him compared to before?
No, I'm not a Satanist, but I'm not a Christian either. It's just that this part always bothered me.
Yes, Lucifer seemed to be quite wicked but casting him out of Heaven instead of showing him love and trying to help him . . . it's almost the same as a parent giving up on an unruly child and kicking them out of the house, making them more messed up than before. That child might go on to commit crimes, put themselves in dangerous situations, take up drug use, etc., when all it might have taken to help them was a different approach from the parents.
- Why would God do such a thing to one of his children?
- Not only that, but his favorite child?
- From what I've heard, Christianity is all about forgiveness, so why couldn't God forgive his son and help him instead of giving up on him and throwing him away?
For this reason and this reason alone, I don't think I could ever be a Christian. Not only is it hypocritical, but it's prompting others to do the same to their loved ones, which I could never condone.
Maybe, deep down, Lucifer was good at heart, and just needed some help. Instead, God cast him away and made him worse than before. I've seen this story play out in front of my eyes too many times in real life. I don't need to worship it in my spiritual life either. I'd like to hear a Christian's side of this.
Who knows, maybe they will help me wrap my head around this better.
Reigh
|
| {
If Christianity is all about forgiveness, why couldn't God forgive Satan instead of trashing him? }
|
|
Paul replied:
|
Dear Reigh,
First, I hesitate to call Lucifer God's son. God has only one consubstantial Son, and that is Jesus.
Okay, that said, the first thing we need to consider here is that we cannot think of angels as similar to human beings. You are anthropomorphizing (ascribing a human form or attributes to <an animal, plant, material object, etc.>) what happened with Satan.
- The similarity is that angels have intellect and will and are therefore persons, like humans are persons.
- However, they're not physical, they have no body or senses, and do not mature, procreate, and grow in wisdom and love as humans do.
Being physical bodily creatures, we begin with partial understanding and weakness of will (due to original sin) and have an entire lifetime to get it right. Confession and Reconciliation makes sense with a species of creature (man) that exists in time and space, and that changes, matures, and is able to repent and convert.
Angels have none of that. They are pure spirits and they do not mature or grow in time as we do. They do not begin with a partial or clouded knowledge of things like we do.
Angels from the moment they are created have full knowledge of exactly what they are doing, and they make an eternal choice for or against God, immediately. Because of their nature, there is no changing their mind afterward. Their choice to hate is never-ending, and as a result they become demons.
Therefore, it is not God who rejects Lucifer, but rather Lucifer who rejects God. And this is an eternal rejection. Banishment from Heaven, which is the fullness of the Life of God, is appropriate. In fact, you could say Satan banished himself. He decided he wanted no life or grace from God, the Source of all life and goodness, and now he seeks to spread his misery to us on earth. God's love was constant, but Satan's freely-chosen hatred is an act of his own free will.
St. Michael the Archangel, pray for us.
Peace,
Paul
|
Mike replied:
|
Thanks for that reply Paul.
I learned a lot of stuff from it.
Mike
|
Bob replied:
|
Thanks Paul for that excellent answer.
One thing I would add is that in the story of creation when God separated the darkness from light, that was the angels.
Many wonder how they don't seem to make it in the creation story, but if you read between the lines, there they are. It happens almost immediately in the creation account, with the lights in the dome of the sky not happening until the fourth day.
Just an interesting aside.
Peace,
Bob Kirby
|
Paul replied:
|
Bob,
A very cool point to ponder.
Paul
|
|
|
