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Hi, Charlene —
It does not surprise me that you
have difficulty with the Trinity
after spending time with the Jehovah's
Witnesses. I spent some time talking
with the JW's as a youth and, as
a consequence, rejected the Trinity
for a length of time. Perhaps I can
help you work these things out.
I do recommend you go to the early
Church Fathers. There are a few things
you have to keep in mind with those
verses you say speak of a singular God.
I think it would be better to say
non-triune God because it
is not the orthodox position that
we believe in multiple gods, i.e., it can be argued that we orthodox
do believe in a single God (we are
monotheists, after all). Anyway, a few things to keep in mind:
- One, if you are getting these
quotes from Jehovah's Witnesses, keep in mind they wrench them
out of context. You must look
at the whole passage in context,
what the author is arguing and
so forth, and consider what else
the author has said or taught.
- You also have to consider the
limitations of thought and language;
in other words, you can't expect
a second-century father to speak
and think like a fourth-century
one. Belief in the Trinity was
implicit in the faith of the early
Christians but they didn't necessarily
know how to express it, at least
in a way we would recognize today.
Let me give you a hint about this
topic based on my experience. Like
you, at first glance,
it seemed pretty clear to me that
Scripture rejected the idea of a
triune God. It seemed a straightforward
case, but as I have come to know
Scripture more deeply, I noticed
that the Trinity is deeply woven
into the threads that make up Scripture.
It's very subtle. For example, with
respect to the divinity of Christ,
consider this passage from Ezekiel
34:11-17:
11 "For this is what
the Sovereign LORD says: I myself
will search for my sheep and look
after them. 12 As a shepherd looks
after his scattered flock when
he is with them, so will I look
after my sheep. I will rescue
them from all the places where
they were scattered on a day of
clouds and darkness. 13 I will
bring them out from the nations
and gather them from the countries,
and I will bring them into their
own land. I will pasture them
on the mountains of Israel, in
the ravines and in all the settlements
in the land. 14 I will tend them
in a good pasture, and the mountain heights of Israel will be their
grazing land. There they will
lie down in good grazing and,
and there they will feed in a
rich pasture on the mountains
of Israel. 15 I myself will tend my sheep and
have them lie down, declares the
Sovereign LORD. 16 I will search
for the lost and bring back the
strays. I will bind up the injured
and strengthen the weak, but the
sleek and the strong I will destroy.
I will shepherd the flock with
justice." 17 As for you,
my flock, this is what the Sovereign
LORD says: I will judge between
one sheep and another, and between
rams and goats.
Compare this to what Jesus says about
Himself:
- Matthew 2:6: 6 "'But you,
Bethlehem, in the land of Judah,
are by no means least among the
rulers of Judah; for out of you
will come a ruler who will be
the shepherd of my people Israel.' "
- Mark 14:27: 27 "You will all
fall away," Jesus told them, "for
it is written: " 'I will
strike the shepherd, and the sheep
will be scattered.'
- John 10:11-16: 11 I am the
good shepherd. The good shepherd
lays down his life for the sheep. 12 The hired hand is not the shepherd
who owns the sheep. So when he
sees the wolf coming, he abandons
the sheep and runs away. Then
the wolf attacks the flock and
scatters it. 13 The man runs away
because he is a hired hand and
cares nothing for the sheep. 14 "I
am the good shepherd; I know my
sheep and my sheep know me — 15 just
as the Father knows me and I know
the Father—and I lay down
my life for the sheep. 16 I have
other sheep that are not of this
sheep pen. I must bring them also.
They too will listen to my voice,
and there shall be one flock and
one shepherd.
- and Matthew 25:31-33: 31 When
the Son of Man comes in his glory,
and all the angels with him, he
will sit on his throne in heavenly
glory. 32 All the nations will
be gathered before him, and he
will separate the people one from
another as a shepherd separates
the sheep from the goats. 33 He
will put the sheep on his right
and the goats on his left.
So the Hebrew Scriptures say that
Jehovah will be the shepherd of Israel,
and Jesus comes in the Gospels and
says that he is the Good Shepherd.
That is a claim to be God. A subtle
one, but not thereby a less ironclad
one. There are many verses like this.
Another one I like is:
Zechariah 11:13: 13 'Then the LORD
said to me, "Throw it to
the potter, that magnificent price
at which I was valued by them." So
I took the thirty shekels of silver
and threw them to the potter in
the house of the LORD.'
Compare to Matthew 26:15 and Matthew
27:3, 7.
Another thing is to observe the trial
of Jesus.
- Why did they put Jesus to death?
- What was the charge? <Blasphemy>
(Mark 14:64).
- What did that mean?
Well, it meant he claimed to be God.
Look at John 10:30-37:
[Jesus said: "] 30 I and the
Father are one." 31 Again
the Jews picked up stones to stone
him, 32 but Jesus said to them, "I
have shown you many great miracles
from the Father. For which of
these do you stone me?"
33 "We are not stoning you
for any of these," replied
the Jews, "but for blasphemy,
because you, a mere man, claim
to be God."
34 Jesus answered them, "Is
it not written in your Law, 'I
have said you are gods'
(Psalm 82:6)? 35 If he called
them 'gods,' to whom the word
of God came — and the Scripture
cannot be broken — 36 what
about the one whom the Father
set apart as his very own and
sent into the world? Why then
do you accuse me of blasphemy
because I said, 'I am God's Son'? 37 Do not believe me unless I do
what my Father does.
So his opponents knew He was claiming
to be God.
- How did Jesus respond
when they confronted him on the issue?
Well he didn't say,
No, no you
misunderstood me, I'm not claiming
to be God.
He basically repeats his claim by
proving that He can claim to be God
from the Hebrew Scriptures.
Another verse you're probably familiar
with is John 8:58-59:
58 '"I tell you the truth," Jesus
answered, "before Abraham
was born, I am!" 59 At this,
they picked up stones to stone
him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping
away from the temple grounds.'
Note that they were trying to stone
him for blasphemy again — claiming
to be God. JW's translate this verse Before
Abraham was, I existed but
this is a bogus translation — the
Greek here is the same as the Greek
of the Septuagint translation of
the verse in Exodus when Jehovah
is speaking to Moses. It's also the
same as Mark 14:64, where the [NWT]
New World Translation (the Jehovah's
Witness Bible), does not translate
it as I existed. It translates
it as I am there as it
should.
I'm not sure whether this is the
issue you're dealing with so I won't
go on further. One additional issue
I'll mention is one other it took
me a long time to shake, and that
is the personhood of the Holy Spirit.
It is true that the Holy Spirit has
a lot of non-personal characteristics,
but He also has some personal characteristics
which establish His personhood. The
one that finally convinced me was 1 Corinthians 12:11:
11 "But one and the same Spirit
works all these things, distributing
to each one individually just
as He wills."
Only a person can will and has a
will. Therefore the Holy Spirit must
be a person.
It's going to take some time to unlearn
the JW errors you learned, but keep
at it. Pray for enlightenment and
seek evidence as you have been doing.
If you have specific questions you
can ask us again.
You asked:
- How is one to
really know who or what God really
is?
I've tried to touch on that but in
general, the answer is, not to sound
trite, listen to the Catholic Church.
Listen to St. Irenaeus:
St. Irenaeus, Against Heresies, 180
A.D., 3, 4, 1:
"When, therefore, we have
such proofs, it is not necessary
to seek among others the truth
which is easily obtained from
the Church. For the Apostles,
like a rich man in a bank, deposited
with her most copiously everything
which pertains to the truth; and
everyone whosoever wishes draws
from her the drink of life. For
she is the entrance to life, while
all the rest are thieves and robbers
[cf, John 10:1-10]. That is why
it is surely necessary to avoid
[heretics], while cherishing with
the utmost diligence the things
pertaining to the Church, and
to lay hold of the tradition of
truth.
- What then?
- If there should
be a dispute over some kind of
question, ought we not have recourse
to the most ancient Churches in
which the Apostles were familiar,
and draw from them what is clear
and certain in regard to that question?
- What if the Apostles
had not in fact left writings
to us?
- Would it not be necessary
to follow the order of tradition,
which was handed down to those
to whom they entrusted the churches?"
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This echoes Jude 3 which refers to
the faith once for all entrusted
to the saints — like
a deposit in a bank.
Here are some tracts you may find
helpful pertaining to the early Church
Fathers teaching on the Trinity:
or go to the Catholic Answers home page, click on the Tracts tab, and search on: God and Christ
Hope this helps,
Eric
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